praguejen@gmail.com wrote:> I've been keeping tabs on the sleep and older children thread, and am> personally quite amazed at how many extracurricular activities (even> for younger children) take place at what I consider to be eating> dinner/getting ready for bed time - i.e. after 7pm! Swimming, piano> lessons, etc....!!!

You must be referring to me. :-)

My kids are 11 and 13 and yes they have swim team practice with aschedule that varies each day. The in-season practice is offered 4 daysa week, and those on the team must commit to attending at least 3practices during the week. There is ONE night a week that meets from 7to 8, so that those who are on the team and have other commitments havea later alternative. My kids don't technically *have* to attend thislater session, but they like to, because that's when the cute guys theyhave crushes on attend. :-) If they are too tired, or have a test tostudy for, or whatever, this is the one night we are most likely toskip.

Piano lessons are private and we could schedule them anytime during theweek, but long ago we chose Friday night because it worked well for us(back then I didn't telecommute; both my ex and I found it easier toslip out an hour early from work on a Friday). We could reschedule thisbut the time continues to work well - I take DD11 with me and tacklegrocery shopping.

> Is this a normal thing in the US? It's definitely> not common here in the Czech Republic...all our activities take place> during the afternoon, and the latest we get home is after judo on> Thursday afternoon - we're home by 6 or 6:15. Evening activities are> VERY rare here.

They're pretty common here, to accomodate working families.

> Now, my son (3rd grade) is finished with school at noon or 1pm every> day - he starts at 8am - which I know is also quite different than in> the US. There is also a very strong program of state-subsidized> after-school care until 5pm, which most kids participate in to some> degree (and the fee is so nominal that it's laughable - approx $80 a> YEAR), during which most schools offer classes, such as dance,> computers, music, languages, etc.

We don't have any state-subsidized afterschool care. It's all comes outof our own pockets (unless you qualify for welfare funding). I've beenlucky because our grade school runs an excellent, affordableafterschool care program that goes beyond mere kid-sitting. Now thatthey are in middle school, they attend a Y teen program which givesthem a couple of benefits:

1) The flexibility to attend school-sponsored activities (such as mathclub, guitar, theater, sports, etc), held from 2:50 until 4:30, andthen walk to the teen program, which is only a mile from their school.

Middle school-sponsored activities are free, but they are notconsistent enough to rely on them for year-round supervision (forexample a club might run for a 6-8 week period only; also no activitiesare held on early-release Tuesdays, because the teachers are all inplanning). All activities end by around 4:30 - 5:00; no kids areallowed on school property after 5 pm.

2) The ability to attend swim team practice, since it's right there atthe Y. Or just swim laps at any time, if they feel like it.

3) Once they hit age 14, the girls are allowed full use of the Yfacilities and can take aerobic classes, etc.

4) Prior to age 14, the girls can use the teen fitness facilities(specially designed weight equipment and a rock-climbing wall).

> Just very interesting for me the differences in culture - and not hard> to see why American kids are sleep-deprived. :)

Yep!

I've found it's even worse in grade school than in middle school.Soccer and softball were a nightmare, with late practices interferingwith prime dinner time several times a week. We tried those once, andthen didn't sign up for it again because it wasn't any fun with tired,hungry and cranky kids.

There are activities held during afterschool hours. You need anon-working parent, nanny, grandparent, or neighbor who can drive themto and from (remember in the US everything takes a drive in the carbecause we don't have very good public transportation and unless you'rein an urban area, few things are in walking distance). I know when Iwas visiting friends in Kyoto, even a 5 year old kid is expected totake public transportation or walk alone, and it's safe becauseeveryone watches out for the kids. I was impressed with that. You won'tsee that around here.

Some people rely on carpooling, but if you work full-time you may findyou don't want to take advantage of the one mom in the neighborhoodwho's a SAHM or who has a nanny. Also around here we have local-motionvans you can hire to cart your kids around for you. Expensive option -I never did this because it seemed to double the cost of the activity.

Bearing in mind that the US is large and quite diverse, I live in anarea that is affluent with expensive housing, and by national standardseveryone is technically "upper class." Within that class, there is,however, a range. While 80% of parents in this town are two-income,there are those families like ours who put our kids in affordableafterschool programs, and those who can afford a live-in nanny. Thenthe rest can afford to have one parent at home.

Those with the live-in nanny or SAHP have someone who can drive kidsall over the place afterschool. These kids tend to be involved inthings like private dance, gymnastics, voice lessons, karate.... alloptions my kids can't do because they meet during afterschool hours(not to mention they're expensive). Those who rely on afterschoolprograms, have a wealth of options like soccer league that costpeanuts, rely heavily on parental involvement to defray costs, but allmeet in prime-time dinner hours and/or on weekends.

Also a result, by Middle school the kids with nannies or SAHP's alltend to flock together, and the kids in afterschool programs all flocktogether. There is *some* social overlap (for example DD11's very bestfriend is in the nanny camp), but not much.

I have to admit my DD13 gets depressed that all the lead roles inmiddle school end up going to the kids who have been enrolled in actingand voice classes since grade school. She's had no opportunity for suchformal training. In grade school it was fine because the afterschoolprogram put on an annual play and both DD's could participate. Butmiddle school and on into high school it's different. (Theaterprograms are really big around here - in some ways, bigger thanscholastic sports - the high school has graduated more than one famous,well-known actor).

jen